Wednesday, May 14, 2008

"Issues, Etc." Dist. Resolutions; The Big Map v. 2.0

District map


There are now nine Lutheran Church–Missouri Synod Districts that have passed resolutions related to the cancellation of Issues, Etc. (out of a total of 35 Districts), the Minnesota State Pastoral Conference (Minnesota North District and Minnesota South District) being the latest addition. Since it’s an election year, I thought it only appropriate that we should have a nice red and blue map to keep a running tally of the results. The red districts are those that have passed resolutions. The blue districts are those that are “blue” because they haven’t yet passed a resolution.

Here is the current list, hyperlinked to the resolutions for each district:

Minnesota State Pastoral Conference
(Minnesota North District and Minnesota South District)

Central Illinois District Board of Directors

Central Illinois District Pastors' Conference


Iowa District East Board of Directors

Minnesota South District Board of Directors

North Dakota District Pastors' Conference

South Dakota District Pastors' Conference

South Wisconsin District Pastoral Conference

Southern Illinois District Pastoral Conference

Wyoming District Pastors' Conference

20 comments:

SmallPressFan said...

For all the beating of chests and outcries of indignation regarding the cancellation of 'Issues, Etc.' being made, I do not understand why those multitudes of critics who are demanding the show continue do not contribute the necessary funds and produce the show themselves.

Of course, it will always reain much easier to carp than actually going out and laboring in the vineyard yourself.

pickledbeets said...

SmallPressFan,

How do you know that "the multitudes" aren't contributing the necessary funds to produce the show themselves?

Are you privy to the multitudes' bank account statements? Have Wilken and Schwarz been sharing information with you about any donations they may be receiving for a future show?

I don't know why you would assume the worst about the multitudes. It's not very charitable of you.

Of course, it will always remain much easier to carp than actually to get your facts straight.

rocky said...

Money is not what this is all about. Nor is it a question of which Districts will pass a resolution and which will not. There seems to have been a loss of a sense of who we are and why we call ourselves Lutheran. The average lay member in the pew is hard pressed to tell you why the Lutheran confessions express what they believe and why they are a faithful expostion of the scriptures. Moreover the leadership is encouraging church starts where the name Lutheran is left out as it is seen as a hindrance rather than a help in presenting the Gospel. Until we re-discover who we are and why we should hold fast to the appellation of Lutheran we can anticipate a rapid and further slid down this slippery slope. For further comments along these lines, look to my post at www.on-the-rock.blogspot.com

SmallPressFan said...

pickledbeets: The critics are obviously calling the Synod liars when they claim that the decision to cancel ‘Issues, Etc.’ were not based on financial considerations, so I believe that I could just as fairly ask you where their proof is. Moreover, I could also justly point out the hypocrisy in your stating, "I don't know why you would assume the worst about multitudes." when critics are doing the same regarding the motives of the Synod.

Your attempt to misdirect the issue in your response to my comments shows how this situation has been misused, and how critics refuse to defend their own position.

Again, I ask, if this show is so popular, why can’t a special collection be taken up to continue this ministry? If these LCMS Districts want to be constructive, and truly believe in the value of ‘Issues, Etc.’, they should stop passing resolutions and start redirecting some of their revenues toward continuing this ministry.

As for your statement, “…it will always remain much easier to carp than actually to get your facts straight.” When I start to hear facts regarding this issue rather than seeing it used to attack others, then I will take the critics serious. Until that time, I leave them to their own carping and unproductive machinations, and trust that the LORD will guide those with sincere hearts and good will to find their way through this current brouhaha.

Pastor Gary Held said...

It's not the least bit easy to produce even one hour of quality radio programming. I'm doing Lutheran radio, and it's not easy.

There's a problem with money all through the synod right now. There was considerable cost involved in doing Issues etc. Where the money is going is not too difficult to figure out, and it's a matter of who has the loudest voice these days as to where that money goes.

Pastor Tom Baker told me once that he believes that we are all becoming "mammonites". We worship Mammon as our God. That's all of us.

SmallPressFan said...

Pastor Held: As someone actually involved in "doing Lutheran radio", I would be sincerely interested in hearing your take on this matter. You say that doing "quality radio programming" is "not easy." You also mention, "[t]here was considerable cost involved in doing Issues etc." As someone involved in this field then, do you find the Synod's explanation unbelievable that it was the costs of producing this show that lead them to its cancellation?

I look forward to reading your response.

God bless you and your ministry.

picledbeets said...

Smallpressfan:

You avoided my questions:

How do you know that "the multitudes" aren't contributing the necessary funds to produce the show themselves?

Are you privy to the multitudes' bank account statements? Have Wilken and Schwarz been sharing information with you about any donations they may be receiving for a future show?


You have asserted, without any evidence, that the critics of synod's actions aren't giving to support the show.

Back it up.

Remember, so far, we've only heard one side of this story; that will soon change.

I'd be prepared to retract your confidence in the synodicracy.

Family of Michael & Jen-Yi Paul said...

As Pastor Weedon said, you're having "too much fun" with you red-blue map...it's great. Thanks for taking the time to do it and post it! (btw, I'm a Husker fan and runner as well)

Rick said...

I was a new listener to Issues, Etc. and KFUO in general over the internet, and was excited about what I was hearing. I was about to make another contribution (my first attempt to donate over the internet directly to KFUO failed for some reason) and working to get other Christians involved when suddenly without warning the show disappeared! It was like a punch in the gut. Who pulls a show for financial reasons without first making a plea for funds? Who fires a pastor without warning right before Easter? Even the show's online archives were removed and then later restored in reduced quality. Needless to say, I sent my donation directly to the Wilken/Schwarz fund. I will never forget being sucker-punched by the LCMS leadership. Thanks for this map.

SmallPressFan said...

picledbeets: "You have asserted, without any evidence, that the critics of synod's actions aren't giving to support the show. Back it up."

Actually, I have done no such thing. I said that if so many people want the show to go on, they could contribute to continuing its ministry.

I love the Christian love, goodwill and understanding emanating from those who have taken up this crusade.

I mean, can't you just feel Christian fellowship in a statement like, "Remember, so far, we've only heard one side of this story; that will soon change. I'd be prepared to retract your confidence in the synodicracy."

I have confidence in neither "synodicracy" nor my fellow believers. I believe all fall short of God's perfection, as do I, but I try to take people at their word until proven insincere.

The Synod has put out explanations, financial statements, and has acted, as far as I can see after discussing it with my minister, within their elected purview.

If someone has proof to the contrary, as you seem to be asserting, then it is a great disservice to have not brought it forward before now. To those I have spoke to, and what I have read regarding this matter, this appears to be nothing more than yet another case of petty church politics pitting one faction out of power against those in elected office.

How any of this helps the cause of bringing people to Christ, I have yet to figure out.

pickledbeets said...

Smallpressfan:

Nice try.

You wrote, "I do not understand why those multitudes of critics who are demanding the show continue do not contribute the necessary funds and produce the show themselves."

This is an assertion that the multitudes are not contributing. There is no "if" in what you wrote.

So, again, answer my questions:

How do you know that "the multitudes" aren't contributing the necessary funds to produce the show themselves?

Are you privy to the multitudes' bank account statements? Have Wilken and Schwarz been sharing information with you about any donations they may be receiving for a future show?


Regarding your ad hominem accusation that I lack Christian love, I simple stated a fact. So far, we've only heard one side of this story; that will soon change.

So, you really should be prepared to retract your confidence in the synodicracy.

Anonymous said...

Notice the tactics of employed by Smallpressfan when cornered in the argument:

1) Deny previous statements, or reword them to change their meaning.
2) Accuse the other side of lovelessness.
3) Accuse the other side of harming "the cause of bringing people to Christ."
4) When all else fails, throw in terms like "crusade" and "petty church politics" to characterize the other side's position.

What's next? The eight commandment shuffle? We'll wait and see.

SmallPressFan said...

pickledbeets:
Are you even reading my comments before you post, or are you just so obstinately obtuse in your cause that you can’t even address the one simple questioned since my first post? Once again, I ask, if this show is so popular, why can’t a specific collection be taken up to continue this ministry? Stop repeating the same BS misdirections and accusations and just answer the same question that I have asked in every one of my posts.

anonymous:
1. You are a buffoon. From my first post, I stated: “contribute the necessary funds and produce the show themselves.” My position has remained the same.
2. I think your post pretty well makes my point.
3. Feeling guilty? I never accused one side alone of “harming” the cause of bringing people to Christ; I asked how ANY of this helps the cause of bringing people to Christ. If you are going to quote me, quote me in context and completely.
4. Crusade: “a remedial enterprise undertaken with zeal and enthusiasm”…and as for “petty”, again, I refer people back to your anonymous post to judge for themselves.

Scott Diekmann said...

Turn the other cheek or be deleted,

The Management

pickledbeets said...
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Anonymous said...
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SmallPressFan said...
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Darth Nemoyer said...

http://weedon.blogspot.com/2008/05/and-from-part-of-pastoral-conference.html

The Southern part of the Rocky Mountain District has also passed a resolution expressing concern with what has happened with Issues, Etc.

Darth Nemoyer said...

..In comments on Pr. Weedon's blog post, it was clarified that the "Southern portion" of the Rock Mountain District is the whole of New Mexico.

Anonymous said...

I was musing over the "The Big Map" and thinking of Dr. Strangelove and the scene in the war room when Gen. 'Buck' Turgidson (George C. Scott) complained about the Soviet diplomat seeing "The Big Board". Sorry, Steve Harris